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 Post subject: Aqeedah of Abu Jafer Muhammad ibn Jarir al-Tabari
PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 6:37 pm 
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Ãä ÇáÏíä ÇáÐí äÏíä Èå Ýí ÇáÃÔíÇÁ ÇáÊí ÐßÑäåÇ ãÇ ÈíäÇå áßã Úáì ãÇ æÕÝäÇå¡ Ýãä Ñæì ÎáÇÝ Ðáß Ãæ ÃÖÇÝ ÅáíäÇ ÓæÇå¡ Ãæ äÍáäÇ Ýí Ðáß ÞæáÇð ÛíÑå Ýåæ ßÇÐÈ ãÝÊÑ¡ ãÚÊÞÏ ãÊÎÑÕ íÈæÁ ÈÅËã Çááå æÓÎØå¡ æÚáíå ÛÖÈ Çááå æáÚäÊå Ýí ÇáÏÑÇíä¡ æÍÞ Úáì Çááå Ãä íæÑÏå ÇáÐí æÚÏ ÑÓæá Çááå Õáì Çááå Úáíå æÓáã ÃÖÑÇÈå¡ æÃä íÍáå ÇáÐí ÃÎÈÑ äÈí Çááå Ãä Çááå íÍáå ÃãËÇáå (2).

æÂÎÑ ÏÚæÇäÇ Ãä ÇáÍãÏ ááå ÑÈ ÇáÚÇáãíä ------------------------

1) ÔÑÍ ÃÕæá ÇÚÊÞÇÏ Ãåá ÇáÓäÉ æÇáÌãÇÚÉ ááÅãÇã ÇááÇáßÇÆí .

2) äÞáÇ ãä ãÌáÉ ÇáÊæÍíÏ¡ ÇáÓäÉ ÇáËáÇËæä¡ ÇáÚÏÏ ÇáËÇäí¡ ÕÝÑ 1422åÜ¡ Õ 36-37 .

äÞáÇ Úä ÇÈæ ÍãíÏ ÇáÝáÇÓì



_________________
+---+---+---+---+
Imaam Shaafee:
in kaana rafdan hubbu aali Muhammad + fal yash'had at-thaqalaani anni rafidi
[Mubarad in al-Kaamil]
+---+---+---+---+


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2005 8:11 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2005 3:12 am
Posts: 51
Location: London, UK
Akhi, that is nice but can you paste a translation


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 6:02 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 12:41 pm
Posts: 104
ibnwalid wrote:
Akhi, that is nice but can you paste a translation


May I summarize it..? It is one of the most excellent creeds of the early 'ulama! Not just because it is by Imam al-Tabari, but also because it proves that he held Imam Ahmad in the greatest esteem, contrary to what some Ash'arites and so-called-Ash'arites say.

Imam al-Tabari's Creed is actually titled: Sarih al-Sunnah.

He begins with the issue of Kalam Allah/Speech of Alah. He says that it is the Speech/Word of God, uncreated in his opinion: be it written, recited, or in any place where it is read; it is uncreated, in heaven or on earth; be it in al-Lawh al-Mahfudh, or in any other written page, engraved in stone, or in the handwriting, or in the heart, or as pronounced etc; whoever says differently, or denies that the Qur'an is on earth or in heaven, except the Qur'an we recite or write, or he believes something else in his heart etc. then he is a Kafir and his blood is permitted. In sort: the Qur'an, from whatever perspective/aspect/direction is the Word of Allah and uncreated; this is a refutation of the Jahmiyyah, the Mu'tazilah, the Kullabiyyah, and most of the Ash'ariyyah (of whom some claim that: all of it is created, except whats in God Himself; or some claim: only what's in Lawhf Mahfuz is uncreated, and that on earth is created; and then there are other diverged opinions, which I shall make clear in the question you asked on the Lafziyyah before - inshallah).
Tabari also says: "wa-annahu min lisani Muhammad.. wa huwa qur'an waahid" Meaning that whether it is heard, recited, written etc. it is still the Qur'an, and therefor of one nature - not in one state 'created' and in another state uncreated as the Lafziyyah says.

In the second passage he refutes vehemently the claim of people who report from the Imam himself, i.e. al-Tabari, something differently, saying: fa-'alayhi la'nat Allah wa-Ghadabuhu, wa-la'nat al-la'inin, wa'l-mala'ika, wa'l-naas ajma'in!!! On him is the Curse of Allah, and his Anger! And the curse of the cursers, and that of the Angels, and the whole people etc..
In short, some people when writing on Imam al-Tabari they put forth some of the false allegations concerning his relationship with the Hanabilah; they claim that there was some kind of conflict between them because of his low opinion of Imam Ahmad: there's no authentic proof for this, rather there's authentic proof contrary to that as this text indicates! I've seen somewhere that even one historian (?) claimed that Imam al-Tabari believed that the Lafz of the Qur'an is created, but this is calumny! Imam al-Tabari curses him!

Then he affirms the seeing of Allah, ta'ala, on the Day of Resurrection, and he includes this belief and himself in the ranks of the Ahl al-Sunnah. An he beliefs that the Mu'minin will see their Lord in al-Jannah, as the authentic reports say.

Then he speaks about the Af'al al-'Ibad, or Actions/Deeds of Mankind, saying: all the good and bad of it is from Allah by his Power - a refutation of the Jahmi Mu'tazilites and others. Also that everything happens by His Will. And that nothing happens newly but only by His Desire, and that both the Creating Power and Command are His - which is partly a refutation of the later-day Mutakallimun, such as many Ash'arites who deny that the Speech of Allah is connected to His Will/Desire. - above - we've gave a quote from al-Tabari on Allah's Ghadab, Anger; some Ash'arites deny this Attribute and say that it means His Will! Then al-Tabari opposes them for he said, "Allah's curse and anger/will (?) upon them,!" and as a consequence, what will we do with al-Tabari's saying that "nothing happens but by His Will" meaning Anger!?! SubhanAllah al-'Azim.

Then he says that Iman consist of saying and doing, it increase and decrease, as a community of the Sahaba testified to. This opposes the whole of the Maturidiyyah!

Then Imam al-Tabari comes back on the issue of Kalam Allah, specifically on al-Lafz al-'Ibad bi'l-Qur'an, saying:

"There's no trace/saying on it from the Companions who went before, or the Followers.." untill he says:

"And in following rightness and guidance, and who stands on the religion, on the first place of the Imams: Abu Abdallah Ahmad b. Muhammad b. Hanbal!"

Then al-Tabari continues: For Abu Isma'il al-Tirmidhi reported to me, saying: I heard Abu Abdallah Ahmad b. Muhammad b. Hanbal say:

"al-Lafziyyah are Jahmiyyah, because of Allah's Saying: Untill he hears Allah's Word. What does he hears?!"

And this is a open refutation of the Ash'ariyyah and their like, as has preceded by a saying quoted here before from the Hanbalite Ibn 'Aqil. And Imam al-Tabari names only Imam Ahmad as authority in this brief 'Aqidah, besides the Prophet and the reference to the Salaf! So who are those who alleg that this one opposes that one?!

Then he says quite beatifully:

"As for the saying of 'the name is the named or is not the named' (al-ism wa'l-musamma issue), then it is from the stupidities (min al-hamaqat) that are innovated" and it is abhored to go into this kind of stuff; and not speaking about this is good.
Then how about the Ash'arites sayings on Allah and His Names & Attributes: They are neither Him nor other then Him, as pronounced by Ibn Kullab, al-Ash'ari and many of their followers!? And how about their saying on Huduth al-'Alam, al-Jawhar wa'l-Tafra, al-Wujud wa'l-Baqa', al-Jism wa'l-Jiha, Sifat al-Ma'ani wa'l-Ma'nawiyyah wa'l-Nafsiyyah, Kalam al-Nafsi and other Hamaqaat!? What would the Imam say about that?!

Then he says: "And know that the Lord is the one upon { al-'Arsh Istawa / lahu ma fi al-Samawaati wa ma fi'l ard wa-ma baynahuma wa-ma taht al-thara }"
Then are the Ahl al-Kalam in agreement that He's upon the Throne?

Then he ends this creed with a testimony to his readers/listeners, saying that this is what we believe. And whoever reports differently or ascribes something to us then he's lying calumnator, sinning, with the Anger of Allah upon him, His curse.. etc.

Insha'Allah, this short creed will be translated by a brother soon on a future website! So be patient akhi.

Was-Salam.

_________________
"Be a Shafi'ite, but not an Ash'arite; be a Hanafite, but not a Mu'tazilite, be a Hanbalite, but not an anthropomorphist"

(Source: Ibn al-Jawziy, al-Muntazam, X, p. 106 - see http://groups.yahoo.com/group/radd_ashariyyah)


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